Crying Wolf with Swine Flu

[Audacity]

With all the criticism of the media for over-hyping swine flu will news outlets now downplay or ignore "news" related to the flu? This story has several troubling factors that, just a few weeks ago, would have led every newscast and story. But now? If you don't want to read this story, here are the main points that have the experts scratching their heads...

People are getting the flu during a time of year that is not considered flu season.

A large number of people contracting this strain of flu are under the age of 20 ... 200 are currently hospitalized, some of them in intensive care which is also unusual and cause for concern.

100,000 Americans are expected to contract this strain of flu.

Mon May 18, 2009 4:12pm
By Maggie Fox (http://blogs.reuters.com/search/journalist.php?edition=us&n=Maggie.Fox), Health and (http://blogs.reuters.com/search/journalist.php?edition=us&n=Health.and) Science Editor (http://blogs.reuters.com/search/journalist.php?edition=us&n=Science.Editor)
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The new influenza strain circulating around most of the United States is putting a worrying number of young adults and children into the hospital and hitting more schools than usual, U.S. health officials said on Monday.
The H1N1 (http://www.reuters.com/news/globalcoverage/swineflu) swine flu virus killed a vice principal at a New York City school over the weekend and has spread to 48 states. While it appears to be mild, it is affecting a disproportionate number of children, teenagers and young adults.
This includes people needing hospitalization -- now up to 200, said Dr. Anne Schuchat of the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
"That's very unusual, to have so many people under 20 to require hospitalization, and some of them in (intensive care units)," Schuchat told reporters in a telephone briefing.
"We are now experiencing levels of influenza-like illness that are higher than usual for this time of year," Schuchat added. "We are also seeing outbreaks in schools, which is extremely unusual for this time of year."
New York City Health Commissioner Dr. Thomas Frieden agreed with Schuchat.
"We're seeing increasing numbers of people going to emergency departments saying they have fever and flu, particularly young people in the 5 to 17 age group, " Frieden, who has been named by U.S. President Barack Obama (http://www.reuters.com/news/globalcoverage/barackobama) as the new CDC director, told a news conference.
About half of all cases of influenza are being diagnosed as the new H1N1 (http://www.reuters.com/news/globalcoverage/swineflu) strain, while the rest are influenza B, or the seasonal H1N1 and H3N2 strains. Flu season in the United States is usually almost over by May.
CDC officials say around 100,000 people are likely infected with the new flu strain in the United States and Schuchat said the 5,123 confirmed and probable cases and six deaths in the United States were "the tip of the iceberg."
MORE ILLNESS OVERALL
"We are seeing more reports of influenza-like illness from outpatient visits that we monitor than is typical for this time of year," Schuchat said.
Because doctors usually treat symptoms and only occasionally give flu tests to patients, the CDC must monitor reports of symptoms such as fever, cough and muscle aches to track flu activity. Some centers are doing actual influenza tests to confirm the patterns that are seen.
Influenza is a factor in 36,000 deaths a year in the United States and 250,000 to 500,000 deaths globally, the CDC says.
"Unlike the seasonal flu, we are seeing relatively few cases or hospitalizations in people over 65," Schuchat said. Usually flu kills the elderly and people with chronic diseases.
There is no evidence that a second, bacterial infection is worsening the H1N1 (http://www.reuters.com/news/globalcoverage/swineflu) cases, Schuchat said.
When family members are questioned, it seems clear that children and teens are more prone to infection than older adults, Schuchat said. "People under 18 are more likely to have infections when another person in the family is infected," she said.
"One of our working hypotheses is that older adults may have some pre-existing protection against this virus due to their exposure long ago to some virus that may be distantly related," Schuchat said.
An alternative hypothesis is that it just has not had a chance to make its way into the older population yet.

[The Mockingbird]

Shut up.

Hospitals around the country are getting swamped by idiots who think they have the swine flu. You're doing more harm than good with alarmism.

[Scarlet Termite]

Shut up.

Hospitals around the country are getting swamped by idiots who think they have the swine flu. You're doing more harm than good with alarmism.

You're pretty smart for someone with TEH MARFANS! :hug:

[The Mockingbird]

DONT JOKE ABOUT THE MARFANS IT IS TEH SERIOUS BUSINESS I CANT EVEN USE A BLACKBERRY BECAUSE MY FRIEND HAS ONE AND WE DONT KNOW HOW TO PLURALIZE THE WORD IF WE TALK ABOUT THEM AT THE SAME TIME.


/Save

[tater]

WOLF! WOLF!!

http://download.lardlad.com/framegrabs/9F05/181.jpg

[Murphy Brown 2003]

Shut up.

Hospitals around the country are getting swamped by idiots who think they have the swine flu. You're doing more harm than good with alarmism.

Says the board moron.

[Sigonfile]

I thought it was over-played until about 15 minutes ago.

KSDK -- A 44-year-old St. Louis County man who was diagnosed with the swine flu has died.
St. Louis County Health Director Dr. Delores Gunn will conduct a news conference at 11:30 a.m. at 111 South Meramec in Clayton at her office to discuss the death.

An autopsy will be performed to confirm that swine flu is the cause of death. The man was diagnosed with the disease several days ago and died this morning.

John Shelton of the St. Louis County Health Department says the man had recently traveled to Mexico.
If it is determined by medical examiners that the patient's death was directly related to the swine flu, this will be the first swine flu death in the St. Louis area.
Before this death, the total number of swine flu-related deaths in the United States was six according to the Centers for Disease Control. Most recently, a teacher at a New York school died on Sunday.

KSDK

[The Mockingbird]

Hang on, it's hard to get to the keyboard, I have to crawl over the bodies of all the people in the office who have died of the swine flu.

Oh right, no I didn't. Because it's just like the normal flu.

Yep, people die, just like the do with the real flu. The numbers and percentages aren't high enough to justify precautions greater than ones the average sane person would take anyway: wash your hands, don't touch your eyes, etc. Seriously, if you're not already doing that, you probably deserve to die through natural selection anyway.

However, how many people are going to die because the army of numbskulls you've marshalled to local hospitals has swamped already overworked hospitals and delayed cared for people who are actually sick?

The WHO has declined to raise its alert level, saying the symptoms of the disease are generally mild.

But don't let the facts ruin a good story, Murph.

[wx or not]

the symptoms of the disease are generally mild.
Oh, they're more than just mild....You're soaking in it!
http://www.tvacres.com/images/admascot_madge_face.jpg

[Murphy Brown 2003]

Hang on, it's hard to get to the keyboard, I have to crawl over the bodies of all the people in the office who have died of the swine flu.

Oh right, no I didn't. Because it's just like the normal flu.

Yep, people die, just like the do with the real flu. The numbers and percentages aren't high enough to justify precautions greater than ones the average sane person would take anyway: wash your hands, don't touch your eyes, etc. Seriously, if you're not already doing that, you probably deserve to die through natural selection anyway.

However, how many people are going to die because the army of numbskulls you've marshalled to local hospitals has swamped already overworked hospitals and delayed cared for people who are actually sick?

The WHO has declined to raise its alert level, saying the symptoms of the disease are generally mild.

But don't let the facts ruin a good story, Murph.

The facts? You wouldn't know a fact if it bit you on the ass and shouted, "hey, Mock, I'm a fact!"

Quote after quote from *medical experts* (read: people a hell of a lot smarter than you), say that there are a number of distinctions between the swine flu and the regular flu, but you keep spouting the same line over and over again. Either you're extremely slow on the uptake or you've caught the Spike disease of believing you're smarter than epidemiologists who make their living studying this stuff.

[Spike]

This includes people needing hospitalization -- now up to 200, said Dr. Anne Schuchat of the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
"That's very unusual, to have so many people under 20 to require hospitalization, and some of them in (intensive care units)," Schuchat told reporters in a telephone briefing.


Way to pick and choose quotes to make the story more sensational. Schuchat ALSO said they believe that part of the reason they're seeing so many out of season reports of "flu-like symptoms" is that people who otherwise wouldn't have bothered going to the doctor are doing so now because of the attention on swine flu. She said it's hard to tell exactly how much of these "additional" flu cases are really unusual and not just noise in the data.

I had "flu-like symptoms" last week. I awoke one day with a low fever, a sore throat, headache and body aches. OMG I HAD THE SWINE FLU!!!! That's what I get for eating at the Chinese buffet where all the Mexicans eat. No, I just had a cold. I drank fluids and took Advil. It lasted about a day. But there are fools out there who would have rushed to the doctor because of all the swine flu hype.

[News Is Broken]

I predict that THIS WILL BE the pandemic that kills the human race once and for all, and to everyone's satisfaction.

[The Mockingbird]

The facts? You wouldn't know a fact if it bit you on the ass and shouted, "hey, Mock, I'm a fact!"

Quote after quote from *medical experts* (read: people a hell of a lot smarter than you), say that there are a number of distinctions between the swine flu and the regular flu, but you keep spouting the same line over and over again. Either you're extremely slow on the uptake or you've caught the Spike disease of believing you're smarter than epidemiologists who make their living studying this stuff.

No, you're the slow one. Here's a medical expert for you, the Director General of the WHO:

“We need to warn the public when necessary, but reassure them whenever possible. This is a difficult balancing act.”

Luckily, the H1N1 virus presently causes mainly mild illness, a pattern we hope continues.


Here's some more facts for you:

WHO is reporting 8829 confirmed cases, including 74 deaths, in 40 countries, as of Monday.
The WHO number represents a .08% fatality rate, which is lower than the normal flu, incidentally.
CDC figures include anyone with flulike symptoms, so the numbers are higher.
The Mockingbird has works in the same Department as a Special Task Force dedicated specifically to the H1N1 flu.
Could the flu get worse? Absolutely, but it hasn't.

Could an asteroid slam into your face? Absolutely, but it also hasn't.

The same precautions people should be taking for the normal flu they should also be taking for H1N1. Wash your frigging hands, don't go into work sick.

Yeah, it could mutate. Warn them then, when there's a real danger. If you haven't cried wolf too much, they might actually believe you.

[Spike]

Could an asteroid slam into your face? Absolutely, but it also hasn't.

FYI:

A meteor hit a woman in Alabama in 1954. It's the only known case of a meteor hitting a human being BUT OMG METEOR STRIKES WE'RE ALL GONNA DIE!!!!!

http://www.xenophilia.com/zb/zb0005/3-19.jpg

(She lived.)

[The Mockingbird]

That's like getting hit with a gold brick, considering how much meteor rock goes for.

Also, did she get a power, like on Smallville?

[Murphy Brown 2003]

No, you're the slow one. Here's a medical expert for you, the Director General of the WHO:

Neither of which backed up your assanine assertions, so thank you for posting quotes which are totally and completely irrelevant to your point. If you need to be re-reminded of your point, check out my post above where I bolded your idiotic comment.

Here's some more facts for you:

Facts (faulty facts, btw) without links. Cool!
[LIST]
WHO is reporting 8829 confirmed cases, including 74 deaths, in 40 countries, as of Monday.
The WHO number represents a .08% fatality rate, which is lower than the normal flu, incidentally.

Who taught you math? That's a 0.8% mortality rate, Einstein.

CDC figures include anyone with flulike symptoms, so the numbers are higher.

Source and link?

[Spike]

That's like getting hit with a gold brick, considering how much meteor rock goes for.

Unfortunately, no. She didn't get any money. In fact, she ended up paying to keep it. What happened was:

Mrs. Hodges rented a house. She was asleep inside it. The meteor hit the house, went through the roof and smacked her on the hip. Going through the roof is probably what kept it from killing her.

Her landlord laid claim to the meteor, saying that since it fell on his property, it belonged to him. Mrs. Hodges refused to give it to him, so he sued her for it. Apparently he was right, he did have some kind of ownership claim. She ended up paying him for the meteor.

By the time the court case was over, everybody had forgotten the story. The meteor wasn't worth very much any more, and she couldn't find a buyer. So she donated the rock to a museum. If it happened now it would probably be worth a fortune, because the rock traders can find each other a lot easier on the internet.

[The Mockingbird]

I wonder if renter's insurance covers meteor strikes?

[wx or not]

Only if no connection to an act of God exists.

[tater]

A meteor hit a woman in Alabama in 1954. It's the only known case of a meteor hitting a human being BUT OMG METEOR STRIKES WE'RE ALL GONNA DIE!!!!!


Not as long as Bruce Willis lives.

http://images.art.com/images/-/Bruce-Willis---Armageddon-Photograph-C10102105.jpeg

[Sparky]

...and his hairpiece lives with him.

[News Is Broken]

Who taught you math? That's a 0.8% mortality rate, Einstein.


Who taught you f--king manners? God, what a b1tch..... :rolleyes:

I don't even care if you're right or wrong at this point. Do the internet a favor and buy some midol. Seriously.

[Another side]

Who taught you f--king manners? God, what a b1tch..... :rolleyes:

I don't even care if you're right or wrong at this point. Do the internet a favor and buy some midol. Seriously.

I gather you don't realize how ridiculous you sound.

And let's review: One other time you suggested she get laid ... now it's a reference to Midol.

What is it about women that threaten you?

[Scarlet Termite]

No one has mentioned if this person, like the vice principal in NYC, had an underlying condition that the flu exacerbated thereby causing the death.

Oftentimes, it's the pneumonia that develops as a result of the flu that does the actual killing.


SAVE US FROM TEH PNEUMONIAS!

[Mom]

Hey, we finally got a couple of cases where I live. Up until a few days ago, my state's motto was: "Even Swine Flu won't come here."

[The Mockingbird]

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Mockingbird http://openline.medialine.com/vbully/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://openline.medialine.com/showthread.php?p=571702#post571702)
No, you're the slow one. Here's a medical expert for you, the Director General of the WHO:

Neither of which backed up your assanine assertions, so thank you for posting quotes which are totally and completely irrelevant to your point. If you need to be re-reminded of your point, check out my post above where I bolded your idiotic comment.

I already said the swine flu was different from traditional influenza. That, however, does not mean it is more dangerous. It's not.



Quote:
Here's some more facts for you:
Facts (faulty facts, btw) without links. Cool!

Quote:
[LIST]
WHO is reporting 8829 confirmed cases, including 74 deaths, in 40 countries, as of Monday.
The WHO number represents a .08% fatality rate, which is lower than the normal flu, incidentally.
Who taught you math? That's a 0.8% mortality rate, Einstein.


Quote:
CDC figures include anyone with flulike symptoms, so the numbers are higher.
Source and link?

Obviously it takes a genius to figure out that WHO facts would be available, at gasp, The World Health Organization Website.

Since you obviously weren't capable of clicking on the main page of the WHO, where a link was prominently featured on the main page, here's it is:

http://www.who.int/csr/don/2009_05_20/en/index.html

Yep, I misplaced a decimal point in the death rate due to a typo. That's still a mortality rate of 8 in 1,000.

Now, I know this is going to be a reach for you, but I got the CDC numbers from, (gasp) the CDC website. On the home page, there's a big box that says H1N1 Info. That is where you get info about H1N1.

In case figuring out the address of the CDC is too much for you:

http://www.cdc.gov/h1n1flu/update.htm

Let me know if you have any further questions, I'm all about easing the worries of panicked and bleating sheep.

[Murphy Brown 2003]

I gather you don't realize how ridiculous you sound.

And let's review: One other time you suggested she get laid ... now it's a reference to Midol.

What is it about women that threaten you?

NIB can't help it. He's too immature to join in the discussions and he certainly isn't very clever. It also drives him crazy that I have him on ignore, so he lashes out in sexist rants.

[Murphy Brown 2003]

No one has mentioned if this person, like the vice principal in NYC, had an underlying condition that the flu exacerbated thereby causing the death.

According to his family, he was an otherwise healthy man. They're doing an autopsy to be sure.

[The Mockingbird]

He visited Mexico, so it's possible he picked up an unknown secondary infection that made the flu more dangerous. That's always been one of the theories as to why the flu has been statistically more deadly in Mexico than anywhere else.

[Murphy Brown 2003]

I already said the swine flu was different from traditional influenza. That, however, does not mean it is more dangerous. It's not.

Actually, the point in your post I was replying to was the fact that you said it wasn't different, but don't let that get in the way.

Obviously it takes a genius to figure out that WHO facts would be available, at gasp, The World Health Organization Website.

Since you obviously weren't capable of clicking on the main page of the WHO, where a link was prominently featured on the main page, here's it is:

http://www.who.int/csr/don/2009_05_20/en/index.html

Now, I know this is going to be a reach for you, but I got the CDC numbers from, (gasp) the CDC website. On the home page, there's a big box that says H1N1 Info. That is where you get info about H1N1.

In case figuring out the address of the CDC is too much for you:

http://www.cdc.gov/h1n1flu/update.htm

Thanks for the links since they helped to prove you're full of it. Your own words:
CDC figures include anyone with flulike symptoms, so the numbers are higher.

The words on the CDC website above the box that shows the number of cases, thanks to that handy dandy link you provided:
Confirmed and Probable Cases

So, "confirmed and probable cases" translates to "anyone with flulike symptoms" in your world? This is precisely why I asked for a link and source.

Yep, I misplaced a decimal point in the death rate due to a typo. That's still a mortality rate of 8 in 1,000.

But let's review: your whole point with that bogus 0.08% mortality rate was to say it was lower than the season flu. A mortality rate of 0.8% makes that statement false. Therefore, it isn't just a misplaced decimal point that we can smack our foreheads with and dismiss; that decimal point makes your entire point fall apart at the seams.

Let me know if you have any further questions, I'm all about easing the worries of panicked and bleating sheep.

With your ignorance and faulty assumptions? No thanks. I think I'll trust the experts on this.

[Murphy Brown 2003]

He visited Mexico, so it's possible he picked up an unknown secondary infection that made the flu more dangerous. That's always been one of the theories as to why the flu has been statistically more deadly in Mexico than anywhere else.

Thanks, Dr. Mock. We'll be sure to take your word for it and not the word of the scientists working on his case.

[wx or not]

Thanks, Dr. Mock. We'll be sure to take your word for it and not the word of the scientists working on his case.
Careful...Doc Mock was the worst of Spiderman's villains....

[The Mockingbird]

You're right that I've made some math errors in the past. For instance, I believe I said you were 10.0% *****. But let's look at your arguments, which have increasingly become 1000% anal-retentive.

You said that I said H1N1 was the same as the "regular" flu. I did not. It is a different virus. Is it having similar effects as traditional flu? Yes.

The reason the cases are known and probable is because the Flu Surveillance Detection Network also relies on data from thousands of outpatient facilities, which do not test specifically for viral load, but instead report based upon symptoms.

Each week, approximately 1,300 outpatient care sites around the country report data to CDC on the total number of patients seen and the number of those patients with influenza-like illness (ILI) by age group. For this system, ILI is defined as fever (temperature of 100°F or greater) and a cough and/or a sore throat in the absence of a KNOWN cause other than influenza.


Since you're a tedious shrew, here's a pre-emptive link:

http://www.cdc.gov/flu/weekly/fluactivity.htm

Still, the CDC does estimate that 34.3 percent of flu cases right now are novel H1N1 strains:

http://www.cdc.gov/flu/weekly/

Finally, here's a picture for you:

Centers for Disease Control and Prevention
http://www.cdc.gov/flu/weekly/weeklyarchives2008-2009/images/bigpi18.GIF http://mtrics.cdc.gov/b/ss/cdcgov/1/H.6-pdv-2/s7643122125409?[AQB]&ndh=1&t=20/4/2009%2012%3A13%3A3%203%20240&cl=Session&pageName=Pneumonia%20and%20Influenza%20Mortality%2 0for%20122%20U.S.%20Cities&g=http%3A//www.cdc.gov/flu/weekly/weeklyarchives2008-2009/bigpi18.htm&cc=USD&ch=CDC%20Flu&h1=AllFlu%7EFlu&c22=AllFlu&c23=Flu&pid=CDC%20-%20Influenza%20%28Flu%29%20%7C%20Weekly%20Report%3 A%20Influenza%20Summary%20Update%20Week%2018%2C%20 2008-2009%20Season&pidt=1&oid=http%3A//www.cdc.gov/flu/weekly/weeklyarchives2008-2009/bigpi18.htm&ot=A&oi=487&s=1024x768&c=32&j=1.3&v=Y&k=Y&bw=792&bh=471&ct=lan&hp=N&[AQE]

You'll notice that the current deaths are slightly above the seasonal norm, but below the epidemic threshold.

[Murphy Brown 2003]

You're right that I've made some math errors in the past. For instance, I believe I said you were 10.0% *****. But let's look at your arguments, which have increasingly become 1000% anal-retentive.

You said that I said H1N1 was the same as the "regular" flu. I did not.

Really? From page one of this very thread:

Hang on, it's hard to get to the keyboard, I have to crawl over the bodies of all the people in the office who have died of the swine flu.

Oh right, no I didn't. Because it's just like the normal flu.

Did you forget that line?

It is a different virus.

No kidding, Dick Tracy. I never said you claimed it was the same virus.

Is it having similar effects as traditional flu? Yes.

Which is, once again, where you're wrong. It's those kinds of statements that get you in trouble with anyone who has two brain cells to spare.

From Reuters:

The new influenza strain circulating around most of the United States is putting a worrying number of young adults and children into the hospital and hitting more schools than usual, U.S. health officials said on Monday.

While it appears to be mild, it is affecting a disproportionate number of children, teenagers and young adults.

"That's very unusual, to have so many people under 20 to require hospitalization, and some of them in (intensive care units)," Schuchat told reporters in a telephone briefing.

"We are now experiencing levels of influenza-like illness that are higher than usual for this time of year," Schuchat added. "We are also seeing outbreaks in schools, which is extremely unusual for this time of year."

"Unlike the seasonal flu, we are seeing relatively few cases or hospitalizations in people over 65,"

Are you really having that big a problem with reading comprehension?

The reason the cases are known and probable is because the Flu Surveillance Detection Network also relies on data from thousands of outpatient facilities, which do not test specifically for viral load, but instead report based upon symptoms.

I didn't realize it was possible for someone to be so wrong about so many things all in one thread. Probable cases are detected by a flu test which tells you if the person has type A or type B influenza. Type B is some other type of flu infection, while type A is the type that's seen in swine flu. Therefore, the probable cases are NOT based on symptoms (ahem, ahem, I'm coughing, quick, ER, report it to the health dept. as a probable case of the swine flu -- you've gotta be kidding me if you really think the numbers come from that!), as you'd like us to believe, but rather on cases in which initial tests showed that the virus infecting the host is most likely swine flu and a sample has been sent for absolute confirmation.

From the link that YOU provided:

The WHO and NREVSS collaborating laboratories report the total number of respiratory specimens tested and the number positive for influenza types A and B each week to CDC. Most of the U.S. WHO collaborating laboratories also report the influenza A subtype (H1 or H3) of the viruses they have isolated and the ages of the persons from whom the specimens were collected. The majority of NREVSS laboratories do not report the influenza A subtype. Reports from both sources are combined and the weekly total number of positive influenza tests, by virus type/subtype, and the percent of specimens testing positive for influenza are presented in the weekly influenza update, FluView. Some of the influenza viruses collected by U.S. WHO collaborating laboratories are sent to CDC for further characterization, including gene sequencing, antiviral resistance testing and antigenic determination. This information is presented in the antigenic characterization and antiviral resistance sections of the FluView report.

And:

Surveillance for Novel Influenza A Viruses- In 2007, human infection with a novel influenza A virus became a nationally notifiable condition. Novel influenza A virus infections include all human infections with influenza A viruses that are different from currently circulating human influenza H1 and H3 viruses. These viruses include those that are subtyped as nonhuman in origin and those that are unsubtypable with standard methods and reagents. Rapid reporting of human infections with novel influenza A viruses will facilitate prompt detection and characterization of influenza A viruses and accelerate the implementation of effective public health responses.

You really should stop now.

Finally, here's a picture for you:

You'll notice that the current deaths are slightly above the seasonal norm

Hey, you got one! :)

That's exactly right, which is why I called you on your faulty math on the mortality rate.

[jrat33]

Oh for F's sake.....

[wx or not]

Oh for F's sake.....
Hey kids, what are the five F's for today?:D

[Spike]

Even with her on ignore, the sheer number of Murphy's posts looks like shrieking in my monitor.

[Murphy Brown 2003]

Even with her on ignore, the sheer number of Murphy's posts looks like shrieking in my monitor.

You realize you look like an even bigger idiot when you say stuff like that, right? What am I thinking, no, of course you don't. That would require some level of self-awareness. But just so you know, that's how you -- and your 8900+ posts look -- look to the rest of us.

[Spike]

Is there a way to set the user controls so that her messages don't show up at all?

[Murphy Brown 2003]

Is there a way to set the user controls so that her messages don't show up at all?

Glad to make your day! Now, if you're finished looking for attention and really want to avoid seeing my posts (you know, rather than just saying that while you skip on over to your other browser so you can relish every word), here's a tip -- get out of this thread. It's not like you have anything of any value to contribute anyway.

[The Mockingbird]

I'm going to be brief because you're annoying, and I have budget hearing minutes to review.

1. Like does not equal the same.

2. It's having similar effects in that the mortality rates are similar.
(In case you didn't get this last time, that doesn't mean the same)

3. Researchers also said the most likely reason old people aren't being hospitalized is because the 1957 pandemic provides a partial resistance to this new strain. They also think that transmission numbers could be correlational and not causational. In other words, kids got the flu first, so they're getting it more.

4. Probable. Flu-like ilnesses. How frigging hard is it for you to understand the lack of granularity in reporting data?

I already gave you the proof that the methodology of data retrieval includes all types of flu and flu like symptoms, hence the probable.

I guess "reading comprehension" is just something like you like to say.

I didn't realize it was possible for someone to be so wrong about so many things all in one thread. Probable cases are detected by a flu test which tells you if the person has type A or type B influenza. Type B is some other type of flu infection, while type A is the type that's seen in swine flu

No it's not, you are a complete idiot. Type A influenza also includes H3 infections, which includes the seasonal flu. Type indicates the SEVERITY of the strain. Type B strains produce less intense symptoms, and Type C strains often get mistaken for a cold.

[Murphy Brown 2003]

I'm going to be brief because you're annoying, and I have budget hearing minutes to review.

1. Like does not equal the same.

2. It's having similar effects in that the mortality rates are similar.
(In case you didn't get this last time, that doesn't mean the same)

3. Researchers also said the most likely reason old people aren't being hospitalized is because the 1957 pandemic provides a partial resistance to this new strain. They also think that transmission numbers could be correlational and not causational. In other words, kids got the flu first, so they're getting it more.

4. Probable. Flu-like ilnesses. How frigging hard is it for you to understand the lack of granularity in reporting data?

I already gave you the proof that the methodology of data retrieval includes all types of flu and flu like symptoms, hence the probable.

I guess "reading comprehension" is just something like you like to say.

No it's not, you are a complete idiot. Type A influenza also includes H3 infections, which includes the seasonal flu. Type indicates the SEVERITY of the strain. Type B strains produce less intense symptoms, and Type C strains often get mistaken for a cold.

First, I never said that type A can't include the seasonal flu. Type A includes both regular flu AND swine flu, but type B does NOT include swine flu and that's the difference. Your last paragraph proves how terribly ignorant you are about this topic.

Educate yourself:

The ABCs of influenza viruses
Influenza viruses are divided into three types (strains) of viruses — influenza A, B and C. Type A is responsible for the deadly influenza pandemics. Type B can lead to smaller, more localized outbreaks. Less common and more stable than other strains, type C has milder symptoms. Either types A or B can cause the flu that circulates almost every winter. Types B and C are usually found only in humans, whereas type A infects both people and animals, including birds, pigs, horses, whales and seals.

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/bird-flu/DS00566/DSECTION=causes

Therefore, when someone presents with symptoms of the flu at this time of year and under these circumstances and they do a flu test and it comes back as a type A virus (possibly with further cultures) or type B and C are ruled out, it's sent to the health department for more testing. No doctor has entered "probable case of swine flu" data based solely on flu-like symptoms.

ETA: To further prove my point:

A probable case of novel influenza A (H1N1) virus infection is defined as a person with an influenza-like-illness who is

* positive for influenza A, but negative for human H1 and H3 by influenza RT_PCR

http://www.cdc.gov/h1n1flu/casedef.htm

So do us all a favor and read up on this illness before you call *me* an idiot when it's painfully obvious you're the one who doesn't know the facts.

[Kace]

I haven't missed the boat on fearing for my life yet, have I?

[The Mockingbird]

1. They don't always do a culture, sometimes doctors just report flu-like symptoms, especially for earlier data.

2. The reason the most severe virii are in type A are because they are zoonotic. Congratulations, you've caught up to 2pm Eastern. However, there are a number of relatively benign strains in this classification.

It amazes me that you still think you're right. It's not 1918, it's not even 1957.
People are going to die, yes. They always do. Declaring it the end of the world or a global emergency will only make other people die unnecessarily, and possibly more.

[Murphy Brown 2003]

1. They don't always do a culture, sometimes doctors just report flu-like symptoms, especially for earlier data.

Source and link? I have yet to hear of ANY "probable" case of swine flu being labeled as such solely from symptoms. If you have, then I assume you can supply the source and the link.

2. The reason the most severe virii are in type A are because they are zoonotic. Congratulations, you've caught up to 2pm Eastern. However, there are a number of relatively benign strains in this classification.

No one said anything about type A being exclusive to swine flu. It's a fact that swine flu falls into the type A subtype. Therefore, all swine flu infections are type A, but not all type A infections are swine flu. No one said otherwise. Up until a second ago, you didn't even know what type A was (you thought it was simply severity of illness) so don't try to pretend now that you're educating the rest of us.

It amazes me that you still think you're right.

I've proven that I'm right over and over again and unlike you, I did so with relevant data and links.

People are going to die, yes. They always do. Declaring it the end of the world or a global emergency will only make other people die unnecessarily, and possibly more.

Well, let's see. First, I have yet to hear or see anyone declare it the end of the world. Well, except for you and Spike and Delta Dawn. Second, I have yet to hear about people dying unnecessarily b/c of panic of a "global emergency." If you have, I assume you'll provide us with a source and link, just like above. Otherwise, STFU and stop making up crap to hide your obvious ignorance.

[wx or not]

Next up on Doctors' Roundtable, "Why Can't Johnny Blink?"

[Spike]

I haven't missed the boat on fearing for my life yet, have I?

No, you can still panic as long as there are people like Murphy trying so desperately to Keep Hype Alive.

[tater]

I haven't missed the boat on fearing for my life yet, have I?

You can also blame Obama for not telling you to fear for your life.

[Kace]

The President's much too busy talking with pirates.

[The Mockingbird]

Source and link? I have yet to hear of ANY "probable" case of swine flu being labeled as such solely from symptoms. If you have, then I assume you can supply the source and the link.

I've already provided you with the links, you clueless dolt. The reason the column is confirmed and probable cases is because not everyone tests, and the tests weren't available at the start of the outbreak. Some of these numbers may be clarified down the road, as doctors send samples to be tested.

No one said anything about type A being exclusive to swine flu. It's a fact that swine flu falls into the type A subtype. Therefore, all swine flu infections are type A, but not all type A infections are swine flu. No one said otherwise. Up until a second ago, you didn't even know what type A was (you thought it was simply severity of illness) so don't try to pretend now that you're educating the rest of us.

They ARE a measure of severity. The virii are more dangerous because they've only recently evolved the capability to infect human hosts (relatively speaking). Natural selection tends to make virii less deadly to human hosts over time.

I've proven that I'm right over and over again and unlike you, I did so with relevant data and links.

No, you haven't.

Well, let's see. First, I have yet to hear or see anyone declare it the end of the world. Well, except for you and Spike and Delta Dawn. Second, I have yet to hear about people dying unnecessarily b/c of panic of a "global emergency." If you have, I assume you'll provide us with a source and link, just like above. Otherwise, STFU and stop making up crap to hide your obvious ignorance.

Overplay of media coverage of the swine flu is creating the appearance of a global emergency. That kills people, however indirectly.

[wx or not]

Good afternoon, viewers. It's a beautiful spring day here in Wimbeldon. Our final match is Mockingbird versus Murphy, and we are close to set. The ball is now in Murphy's court....quiet please.

[FD2BLK]

I haven't missed the boat on fearing for my life yet, have I?

I paniced two weeks ago and got it out of my system.

[Murphy Brown 2003]

I've already provided you with the links, you clueless dolt.

Links that contradict what you say. So, I'll take that as proof that you not only don't know what you're talking about, but you're too clueless to realize you don't know what you're talking about.

The reason the column is confirmed and probable cases is because not everyone tests, and the tests weren't available at the start of the outbreak. Some of these numbers may be clarified down the road, as doctors send samples to be tested.

That's a flat-out lie.

They ARE a measure of severity. The virii are more dangerous because they've only recently evolved the capability to infect human hosts (relatively speaking). Natural selection tends to make virii less deadly to human hosts over time.

Lie, lie, lie.

No, you haven't.

More lies.

Overplay of media coverage of the swine flu is creating the appearance of a global emergency. That kills people, however indirectly.

And finally, a whopper of a lie.

What's alarming to me is that someone as ignorant as you is on a site like this. You've done nothing but back up lies with more lies all the while pretending that you're informed about something you're painfully clueless about.

[Murphy Brown 2003]

Good afternoon, viewers. It's a beautiful spring day here in Wimbeldon. Our final match is Mockingbird versus Murphy, and we are close to set. The ball is now in Murphy's court....quiet please.

Nah, Dr. Mock is a moron. That's evidenced by the fact that he spouts the same ignorant line, despite direct evidence (and CDC links) to the contrary. He can't back up any of his assertions, so he makes it up as he goes along and hopes he won't be called on it. Nothing he says is worth the attention of a tennis match.

[wx or not]

Serving ace to Murphy. Mockingbird addresses the ball, and...

[The Mockingbird]

I said:
The reason the column is confirmed and probable cases is because not everyone tests, and the tests weren't available at the start of the outbreak. Some of these numbers may be clarified down the road, as doctors send samples to be tested.

You said: (and my, how impeccably referenced and sourced, like you supposedly always do.)

That's a flat-out lie.

Why you're wrong: (and a complete douchebag). Quotes from cdc.gov (http://openline.medialine.com/cdc.gov):

Most of the U.S. WHO collaborating laboratories also report the influenza A subtype (H1 or H3) of the viruses they have isolated and the ages of the persons from whom the specimens were collected.

The reported information answers the questions of where, when, and what influenza viruses are circulating. It can be used to determine if influenza activity is increasing or decreasing, but cannot be used to ascertain how many people have become ill with influenza during the influenza season.

However, the sensitivity and specificity of the different rapid tests is not yet known for this novel virus. CDC has received anecdotal reports of false positive and false negative results.


I said:

They ARE a measure of severity. The virii are more dangerous because they've only recently evolved the capability to infect human hosts (relatively speaking). Natural selection tends to make virii less deadly to human hosts over time.

You said:

Lie, lie, lie.

Why you're wrong:

You're saying that natural selection doesn't make viruses less deadly to human hosts over time? You're completely clueless. Here's a quote from Dr. Christopher Olsen, a molecular virologist who studies swine flu at the University of Wisconsin School of Veterinary Medicine in Madison:

As the virus adapts to its human hosts, it is likely to find ways of spreading more efficiently. But evolution also suggests it might become less dangerous, Olsen said.

Source: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2009/04/29/20090429swineflu-reality29-ON.html



I said:

Overplay of media coverage of the swine flu is creating the appearance of a global emergency. That kills people, however indirectly.

You said:

And finally, a whopper of a lie.

Why you're wrong:

When people think their lives are in danger, their behavior changes. They go out less, and by large, spend less. A large scale change in behavior will have a corresponding tick in the nation's economic health.

When the economy takes a downturn, some of the first organizational structures hit are charities. When people are worried about themsleves, they give less. This is fairly obvious.

According to Catholic Charities, there are more than 35 million people in America alone who live in households that are "Food Insecure". Luckily, Americans have better access to help and government services than in other parts of the world.

But how about Cambodia? Darfur?

Here's a number for you: About 24,000 people die every day from hunger or hunger-related causes, which is down from 40,000 every day twenty years.
(Courtesy: The World Health Organization)

There are a number of ways that large, panicked groups of people can indirectly harm other people. Obviously you're too thick to understand this, but I hope that some of the other producers, reporters, anchors, and assignment editors are getting the message.

Kk, thx.

[wx or not]

An extreme volley from Mockingbird seems to have split this match evenly. Murphy has regrouped, and appears ready to serve...

[Murphy Brown 2003]

I said:
The reason the column is confirmed and probable cases is because not everyone tests, and the tests weren't available at the start of the outbreak. Some of these numbers may be clarified down the road, as doctors send samples to be tested.

Let's take a look at the evidence you gave to back up your bogus claim that "not everyone tests, and tests weren't available at the start of the outbreak."

Does this help your case?

Most of the U.S. WHO collaborating laboratories also report the influenza A subtype (H1 or H3) of the viruses they have isolated and the ages of the persons from whom the specimens were collected.

Nope. That says that labs report the type A virus they've isolated and the ages of the patients. The word "isolated" implies tests. That's what cultures are all about. So in your haste to prove something that's false, you proved my case. Thank you. Nowhere does it say that doctors don't test or that the test wasn't available.

Let's look at your next piece of "evidence":

The reported information answers the questions of where, when, and what influenza viruses are circulating. It can be used to determine if influenza activity is increasing or decreasing, but cannot be used to ascertain how many people have become ill with influenza during the influenza season.

Assuming this is a CDC reasoning to define the phrase "probable case of swine flu," which I very, very highly doubt, let's dissect it. They say that the "reported information" (though it doesn't say which reported information -- numbers, stats, presumably?) tells where, when, and what viruses are circulating to possibly tell if activity is increasing or decreasing, but can't tell us how many people have become ill during flu season.

Aside from the fact that this is -- in no way -- a definition of "probable case" and is, therefore, worse than irrelevant to the discussion, it also doesn't prove your case that doctors didn't test for the flu or that the tests weren't available at the start of the outbreak.

Moving on:

However, the sensitivity and specificity of the different rapid tests is not yet known for this novel virus. CDC has received anecdotal reports of false positive and false negative results.

This one's my favorite. You know why? I'll tell you anyway. The above contradicts what you say 100%. Read the words in plain English and try to comprehend as you read. "...specificity of the different rapid tests is not yet known for this novel virus. CDC has received anecdotal reports of false positive and false negative results."

That proves that doctors DID and DO test. Otherwise, the accuracy of the test would not be disputed. Once again, you try to prove that doctors didn't test or a test wasn't available and you fail miserably.

You're saying that natural selection doesn't make viruses less deadly to human hosts over time?

I never said anything of the sort. Any moron with a third-grade education understands that. What I said was that you're wrong when you say that subtypes of the influenza virus are used only to describe severity. I've already proved that you're wrong on that front with quotes from the Mayo Clinic about type A and why types B and C are used to rule out swine flu while type A opens the door to the possibility of it.

When people think their lives are in danger, their behavior changes. They go out less, and by large, spend less. A large scale change in behavior will have a corresponding tick in the nation's economic health.

When the economy takes a downturn, some of the first organizational structures hit are charities. When people are worried about themsleves, they give less. This is fairly obvious.

According to Catholic Charities, there are more than 35 million people in America alone who live in households that are "Food Insecure". Luckily, Americans have better access to help and government services than in other parts of the world.

But how about Cambodia? Darfur?

Here's a number for you: About 24,000 people die every day from hunger or hunger-related causes, which is down from 40,000 every day twenty years.
(Courtesy: The World Health Organization)

There are a number of ways that large, panicked groups of people can indirectly harm other people. Obviously you're too thick to understand this, but I hope that some of the other producers, reporters, anchors, and assignment editors are getting the message.

The world according to Dr. Mock. As I said posts and posts ago, I think I'll listen to the experts instead, especially now that you've proved yourself to be utterly incompetent and dangerously misinformed on this topic.

[wx or not]

The judges were called on this serve. It seemed to go over the line, but there is no fault. Love 30. Service, Mockingbird.

[The Mockingbird]

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Mockingbird
I said:
The reason the column is confirmed and probable cases is because not everyone tests, and the tests weren't available at the start of the outbreak. Some of these numbers may be clarified down the road, as doctors send samples to be tested.

Let's take a look at the evidence you gave to back up your bogus claim that "not everyone tests, and tests weren't available at the start of the outbreak."

Does this help your case?


Quote:
Most of the U.S. WHO collaborating laboratories also report the influenza A subtype (H1 or H3) of the viruses they have isolated and the ages of the persons from whom the specimens were collected.
Nope. That says that labs report the type A virus they've isolated and the ages of the patients. The word "isolated" implies tests. That's what cultures are all about. So in your haste to prove something that's false, you proved my case. Thank you. Nowhere does it say that doctors don't test or that the test wasn't available.

No I didn't. You're just too thick to get it.

CDC has developed a PCR diagnostic test kit to detect this novel H1N1 virus and has now distributed test kits to all states in the U.S. and the District of Columbia and Puerto Rico. The test kits are being shipped internationally as well. This will allow states and other countries to test for this new virus. This increase in testing will likely result in an increase in the number of confirmed cases of illness reported.

A magic "swine flu test" didn't exist, it was a test has to be developed to detect the virus, and that takes time.

CDC recommends that testing be prioritized for those with severe respiratory illness and those at highest risk of complications from influenza, as reflected in this document.

I never said anything of the sort. Any moron with a third-grade education understands that. What I said was that you're wrong when you say that subtypes of the influenza virus are used only to describe severity. I've already proved that you're wrong on that front with quotes from the Mayo Clinic about type A and why types B and C are used to rule out swine flu while type A opens the door to the possibility of it.

Again, you so want to be right in this argument you're just hearing what you want. I never said only. I said the subtypes do describe severity, which you denied.
Each subtype has a progressively lower bell curve of potential.

"There are certain characteristics, molecular signatures, which this virus lacks," said Peter Palese, a microbiologist and influenza expert at Mount Sinai Medical Center in New York. In particular, the swine flu lacks an amino acid that appears to increase the number of virus particles in the lungs and make the disease more deadly.

In the U.S., between 5 percent and 20 percent of the population becomes ill and 36,000 people die -- a mortality rate of between 0.24 percent and 0.96 percent.

The WHO number represents a 0.8% fatality rate, which is lower than the normal flu, incidentally.

As for the other stuff, it all hinges upon me being wrong. Other than a misplaced decimal point, you have nothing.

[wx or not]

A flurry of activity has now come from Mockingbird, who appears to be stronger than before. All shots from both sides have cleared the net, so it seems as if both sides have not lost any composure. The heat is increasing on the court...

[Tippster]

Poor wolf.

((((((*****vibes*****))))))

[Murphy Brown 2003]

No I didn't. You're just too thick to get it.

Wow. Just. Wow.

CDC has developed a PCR diagnostic test kit to detect this novel H1N1 virus and has now distributed test kits to all states in the U.S. and the District of Columbia and Puerto Rico. The test kits are being shipped internationally as well. This will allow states and other countries to test for this new virus. This increase in testing will likely result in an increase in the number of confirmed cases of illness reported.

A magic "swine flu test" didn't exist, it was a test has to be developed to detect the virus, and that takes time.

Do you even know what a PCR diagnostic test is? Do you know anything at all about the things you're posting? I think not, b/c if you did, then you'd know that you've proven my point 100 times over. Hey, Einstein, the PCR test is so that states don't have to send every probable case of swine flu to the CDC, as they had been doing. The reason they were probable is b/c every patient was subject to a flu test to determine whether the flu virus in a host was type A or type B. THAT'S what determined "probable" as noted about 12 posts ago with a direct link to the CDC. The PCR diagnostic test is not to determine "probable cases." By definition, it's for diagnosis purposes. It's to detect the actual swine flu, as it says right there in the quote YOU provided. What do you think the word "detect" means?

Again, you so want to be right in this argument you're just hearing what you want.

I already know I'm right b/c the *facts* are on my side, not convoluted faulty science that you dreamed up on your way to work.

I never said only. I said the subtypes do describe severity, which you denied.

Let's review. Here's what I said:

Probable cases are detected by a flu test which tells you if the person has type A or type B influenza. Type B is some other type of flu infection, while type A is the type that's seen in swine flu.

To which, you replied:

No it's not, you are a complete idiot. Type A influenza also includes H3 infections, which includes the seasonal flu. Type indicates the SEVERITY of the strain. Type B strains produce less intense symptoms, and Type C strains often get mistaken for a cold.

Instant replay:

while type A is the type that's seen in swine flu.

No it's not, you are a complete idiot... Type indicates the SEVERITY of the strain.

Now, you can say all you want that you didn't say "only severity," but the fact remains that when I informed you that type A is the type found in swine flu, you replied directly (and you can check the original post if you'd like), "no, it's not. You are a complete idiot" before trying to "educate" on how type means severity. The implication of that is making me deaf.

Each subtype has a progressively lower bell curve of potential.

That was never the point. My point, all along, was that according to the CDC, the type (i.e. A or B) of flu virus infecting a patient is determined before qualifying it as a "probable case." And just as a refresher:

A probable case of novel influenza A (H1N1) virus infection is defined as a person with an influenza-like-illness who is

* positive for influenza A, but negative for human H1 and H3 by influenza RT_PCR

http://www.cdc.gov/h1n1flu/casedef.htm

That couldn't possibly be clearer. So are you saying the CDC is lying and "probable" actually extends to people who have a sore throat?

As for the other stuff, it all hinges upon me being wrong. Other than a misplaced decimal point, you have nothing.

According to you and other similarly ignorant people.

[News Is Broken]

I gather you don't realize how ridiculous you sound.

And let's review: One other time you suggested she get laid ... now it's a reference to Midol.

What is it about women that threaten you?

Talk about sounding ridiculous!

No one asked you anyway. Go turn lifetime back on, or you'll miss the part where the evil husband cheats on the poor helpless housewife main character with the babysitter who he will then con into trying to kill the wife so he can collect the insurance money.

:rolleyes:

[Spike]

Mockingbird has clearly won this battle. There's no reason to continue the hysterics.

[News Is Broken]

NIB can't help it. He's too immature to join in the discussions and he certainly isn't very clever. It also drives him crazy that I have him on ignore, so he lashes out in sexist rants.

Funny how a certain nameless someone who is ignoring me can't resist the opportunity to once again, BRAG about ignoring me.

Since I know you're reading this, Smurf, why don't you drop the act. Tell me. Does ignoring me give you some feeling of validation? It must, because you mention it all the time.

And for the record, I take back the Midol comment. It was sexist and wrong of me to say. What I SHOULD have recommended was Prozac. I hear they make a chewable now.

:rolleyes:

[Murphy Brown 2003]

Mockingbird has clearly won this battle. There's no reason to continue the hysterics.

From the runner-up to the biggest moron on the board. Yep, Spike's word inspires confidence, that's for sure.

[News Is Broken]

She must just be a total laugh riot in person.... What charm. What wit.

No... seriously. Where are they? :shifty:

[Spike]

Yep, Spike's word inspires confidence, that's for sure.

As opposed to mindless hysteria and panic over something as silly as the flu.

[Murphy Brown 2003]

As opposed to mindless hysteria and panic over something as silly as the flu.

I have yet to see hysteria and panic, but don't let the facts get in your way.

[Spike]

I have yet to see hysteria and panic...

Obviously you haven't read the shrieking of your own posts.

[Murphy Brown 2003]

Obviously you haven't read the shrieking of your own posts.

And until now, you claimed you hadn't either. Or did you forget you allegedly had me on ignore?

[Sigonfile]

We've dropped the "swine flu" coverage from our first block and now are focusing on the dangers of "sunburn and skin cancer". One way or the other, we'll find some way to kill you off before the end of the year.

[tater]

wx doesn't get it...when talking about tennis you also have to show pictures.

http://media.collegepublisher.com/media/paper344/stills/9mo0d1ks.jpg

[Spike]

And until now, you claimed you hadn't either. Or did you forget you allegedly had me on ignore?

Oh, I do have you on ignore, but I'm still figuring out the most effective way to use it. Ignore gives me a little link at the top right corner of the message that says "View Post." You might think that defeats the purpose, but on the contrary it allows me to keep up with what's going on while controlling the level of unpleasantness. Occasionally I use that link to dip back into the conversation to see if you're still shrieking. I click it, then say, "Yep, she's still stupid." Then I skip over the next two dozen or so of your posts, which takes me up through the next half hour of your rambling, before dipping back in again.

In this thread in particular I've seen enough of your nonsense quoted in the posts where Mockingbird has thoroughly handed you your ass that I can keep up with what's going on without being subjected to the shrillness. I really don't need to read 40 messages from you alone to know what's going on, especially when most of them are just you repeating yourself.

[Murphy Brown 2003]

Oh, I do have you on ignore, but I'm still figuring out the most effective way to use it. Ignore gives me a little link at the top right corner of the message that says "View Post."

LOL, leave it to you! You don't even know how to properly ignore someone. Is there no end to your stupidity?

You might think that defeats the purpose, but on the contrary it allows me to keep up with what's going on while controlling the level of unpleasantness.

I don't see how it's possible to control the level of unpleasantness in your life as long as you're you. I doubt I'm the only one who notes the irony of our resident jackass complaining about "unpleasantness."

Occasionally I use that link to dip back into the conversation to see if you're still shrieking. I click it, then say, "Yep, she's still stupid." Then I skip over the next two dozen or so of your posts, which takes me up through the next half hour of your rambling, before dipping back in again.

Yeah, Spike, that's exactly what you do. Yep, we all buy it. You don't look like a giant tool. Nope, you don't. You really, really don't. And I say that from the bottom of my heart.

In this thread in particular I've seen enough of your nonsense quoted in the posts where Mockingbird has thoroughly handed you your ass

Hey, the next time you two are you going to share a brain, do me a favor and let me know which one of you has it, will you? It's tiring enough dealing with Mock's ignorance without having to pile your moronic ramblings on top. Oh, and in case you're wondering, both of you are idiots when it comes to anything remotely scientific, as you've proved in every swine flu thread thus far.

that I can keep up with what's going on without being subjected to the shrillness. I really don't need to read 40 messages from you alone to know what's going on, especially when most of them are just you repeating yourself.

Nope, you're comfortable burying your head in the sand while racking up 9,000 posts. Newsflash -- when you have three times as many posts as I do, constantly throwing out my post number makes you look, at best, hypocritical, and, at worst, an imbecile.

[Spike]

This message is hidden because Murphy Brown 2003 is on your ignore list.

I don't feel like clicking the "View Post" link for that one. Can someone just tell me, was it shrill and unpleasant?

[Murphy Brown 2003]

I don't feel like clicking the "View Post" link for that one. Can someone just tell me, was it shrill and unpleasant?

The new attention *****, ladies and gentleman. He posts just to say he can. Is anyone truly surprised?

[News Is Broken]

I don't feel like clicking the "View Post" link for that one. Can someone just tell me, was it shrill and unpleasant?

It was Smurftastic.

[The Mockingbird]

After arguing minutiae with you about epidemiology for what seems like an eternity, I'm beginning to see why Spike would find ignoring you such a blissful experience.

I am quite familiar with the Polymerase Chain Reaction technique, thank you very much. I also know that developing a test isn't just heating up a blood sample in a microwave.

It required scientists to create a new set of primers to react with the virus. Once the test was developed, it needed to be scaled up in large numbers, and then shipped out to medical facilities worldwide. The rapid response test development was only completed TWO WEEKS AGO.

This takes time, and requires supplies to be routed to the people doing the testing, which you apparently don't seem to understand. The fact that people don't have to ship samples to the CDC has nothing to do with anything; anyone with a thermal cycler can perform the test -- provided they have the test in the first place.

Let's take a look at the evidence you gave to back up your bogus claim that "not everyone tests, and tests weren't available at the start of the outbreak."

Bogus, eh?

And we already know that not everyone tests, and not every case is tested, because that is the reality of medicine.

You argue pointless minutiae when you have no idea about the subject material.

[BadgerWXman]

I have yet to see hysteria and panic

http://home.hccnet.nl/hans.bellwinkel/startrek/grafisch/str-TNG/LAFORGE.jpg

[Murphy Brown 2003]

After arguing minutiae with you about epidemiology for what seems like an eternity, I'm beginning to see why Spike would find ignoring you such a blissful experience.

I am quite familiar with the Polymerase Chain Reaction technique, thank you very much. I also know that developing a test isn't just heating up a blood sample in a microwave.

It required scientists to create a new set of primers to react with the virus. Once the test was developed, it needed to be scaled up in large numbers, and then shipped out to medical facilities worldwide. The rapid response test development was only completed TWO WEEKS AGO.

This takes time, and requires supplies to be routed to the people doing the testing, which you apparently don't seem to understand. The fact that people don't have to ship samples to the CDC has nothing to do with anything; anyone with a thermal cycler can perform the test -- provided they have the test in the first place.



Bogus, eh?

And we already know that not everyone tests, and not every case is tested, because that is the reality of medicine.

You argue pointless minutiae when you have no idea about the subject material.

My information comes from the CDC and the WHO. Your information comes out of your ass. There is absolutely nothing to suggest every patient that's labeled a "probable case of swine flu" wasn't initially tested. In fact, ALL the evidence suggests exactly the opposite (and I love how you choose to ignore the words in black and white from the CDC that defines what probable case means, by the way). PCR diagnostic tests aren't about probable cases; they're about confirmation. If you can't understand that very, very simple concept, then you truly do need to go back to the fifth grade and demand they teach you better. But you won't b/c you're suffering from the Spike-I'm-never-wrong-I'm-always-right-despite-the-facts syndrome.

P.S. Looking up PCR on Wiki doesn't qualify as being very familiar with it.

[The Mockingbird]

You have no idea where I get my information, but suffice to say I have access to sources that you, as a member of the general public, do not.

Thanks.

[Murphy Brown 2003]

You have no idea where I get my information, but suffice to say I have access to sources that you, as a member of the general public, do not.

Thanks.

If you say so. I could turn that around on you and say the exact same thing, especially when it comes to science. I wouldn't say I'm a member of the "general public" when it comes to that.

[The Mockingbird]

You are a member of the general public, despite whatever college textbooks you've read. I would really, really, love to call you on this, but unfortunately, It's not allowed.




To sum up:

The latest H1N1 strains are widespread, but the effects tend to be relatively mild.
Scientists are watching the latest H1N1 strains for signs of a mutation that could make the outbreak deadlier, a relatively unlikely event.
Overhyping of the swine flu on media outlets has led to panic and changes in spending behavior. Luckily, that trend seems to be diminishing.

[News Is Broken]

Well I think we've finally resolved this, and to everyone's satisfaction.

[Murphy Brown 2003]

You are a member of the general public, despite whatever college textbooks you've read. I would really, really, love to call you on this, but unfortunately, It's not allowed.

College textbooks? You're an even bigger idiot than I thought. How could you possibly call me on anything when you obviously have no idea what I do? You put the "ass" in assumption.

To sum up:

...you're clueless.

[News Is Broken]

Sigh....

or not.

[Kace]

It's all about the incredible makeup sex afterwards.

[News Is Broken]

It's all about the incredible makeup sex afterwards.

Hmmm... well if that's the case, the release of all that stress and tension will likely cause a massive explosion that will completely destroy everything in a 6 mile radius.

[Spike]

Hmmm... well if that's the case, the release of all that stress and tension will likely cause a massive explosion that will completely destroy everything in a 6 mile radius.

Doubt it. She would spend the whole time criticizing and arguing over technique. Who would be able to get his groove on with all that shrieking? Not even Viagra would help.

[Murphy Brown 2003]

Not even Viagra would help.

Coming from the board expert on Viagra, no doubt.

[News Is Broken]

Coming from the board expert on Viagra, no doubt.

You mean there's actually a subject that you are willing to admit another poster on this board knows more about than you?

Amazing. :rolleyes:

[The Mockingbird]

College textbooks? You're an even bigger idiot than I thought. How could you possibly call me on anything when you obviously have no idea what I do? You put the "ass" in assumption.

You're right, I should have said high school textbooks.

[Murphy Brown 2003]

You're right, I should have said high school textbooks.

It took you that long to reply with the lamest of comebacks?

[The Mockingbird]

I was in the intensive care, dying of the swine flu.

[News Is Broken]

I was in the intensive care, dying of the swine flu.

I hate it when that happens.

[Spike]

I have approached death six times now from the swine flu. I feel a seventh bout coming on now. Or maybe this is just SARS.