Plagiarism?

[EC Lion]

Here's the hypothetical: In a small to medium sized TV news shop, a reporter will, sometimes, bring in several VOSOTs instead of packages each day. Essentially he/she becomes a photog and writer as the need arises. On one of those days, a different reporter then uses that reporter's work (script, video, and sound) as part of a larger story. Half of the now larger story was written (let's say verbatim) and cut by someone who's name is no longer on the story.

Let's also add the second reporter made no effort to let the first reporter know his/her work was going to be used. Also factoring in: The report which now appears on the web bears no mention of the first reporter.

Granted, in a large shop, writers and producers will occasionally write for reporters, and reporters will take the credit. What is the protocol in a small to medium sized shop, where the two parties are on the same level?

Is the scenario plagiarism...passing off someone else's work as your own?

Your thoughts.

[Lazlo Toth]

In a legal sense, no. Your work for your company belongs to your company. His or her work for the omcpany belongs to the company. If he or she uses your company owned work in his/her company owned work, it's not plagiarism.

More debatable: is it plagiarism from a moral point of view? Maybe. I would prefer to do my own writing. But from a practical standpoint, it's probably hard to pass up prepared stuff when you're pressed for time.

Consider it a compliment on your wrirint that someone thought enough of it to appropriate it. you'll sleep easier.

[Spike]

Originally posted by Lazlo Toth:
More debatable: is it plagiarism from a moral point of view? Maybe. I would say no on that count as well, as an extension of your legal definition.

When you work for a television station and produce material for a newscast, you are part of a collaborative effort. The part you consider "yours" is really only part of a larger whole. Therefore, legally AND morally you are not the author of your work. Your station or news department is the author of the work.

Therefore it is impossible for it to be plagiarism, since an author cannot plagiarize itself.

Further, plagiarism is the unauthorized use of someone else's work. If your station allows your colleague to use your work, it isn't plagiarism. In fact, if the station were to allow some outside entity use your work, it still wouldn't be plagiarism.

Since the work you produce doesn't belong to you, neither in a legal nor artistic sense, its author can use the material however it sees fit. If your shop allows recycling of the writing, then there's no problem at all. This is no different from using file video. Do you hear photogs whining about other shooters and reporters "plagiarizing" their video and editing when they're used in other packages?

[ March 08, 2007, 09:10 AM: Message edited by: Spike ]

[Ferrycrossthemersey]

It's plagarism to me. I wouldn't do that to anyone; nor would I voice anything that I hadn't written.

[DoneThatToo]

How is that different then if you 'rip and read' some wire copy? Do you attrib everything you get from AP to AP? Do you ever take a VO from a previous show and read any portion of it word for word in another? So a VOSOT was inserted into a package, big deal.

[Consider This]

Originally posted by EC Lion:

Is the scenario plagiarism...passing off someone else's work as your own?
On the air? No.

On a resume tape? Maybe.

[Michigan J. Frog]

Originally posted by Ferrycrossthemersey:
It's plagarism to me. I wouldn't do that to anyone; nor would I voice anything that I hadn't written.I gather your shop doesn't employ writers, then?

[facts]

Originally posted by Ferrycrossthemersey:
It's plagarism to me. I wouldn't do that to anyone; nor would I voice anything that I hadn't written.that's absurd. I guess you'll never ever anchor? unless you want to write every single tease, every vo/sot? will you pick out the sots yourself, or will you let someone else pick them out?

will you write your own leads to packages, or perhaps the reporter who actually knows what the package contains might be able to write it for you?

or are you just going to guess?

"and now, a story about the space shuttle. or possibly about clowns. Here's News 10's Amanda Smith. Or maybe Mike Jones."

[ March 09, 2007, 09:13 AM: Message edited by: facts ]

[facts]

Originally posted by EC Lion:
...someone who's name is no longer on the story... appears on the web bears no mention of the first reporter.
Honestly, this simply sounds petty. You'll be on TV a whole lot.. getting your name in every newscast or on midstatenewschannel.com is not really a day to day concern.

[Sir Dropham Pants]

Originally posted by Ferrycrossthemersey:
It's plagarism to me. I wouldn't do that to anyone; nor would I voice anything that I hadn't written.Can anchors not read a VO or a reader then? If I were a reporter, went out and shot/wrote a vo or vo/sot for tonight's 6pm news and an anchor reads it, aren't they voicing my work? I don't get credit, the anchor does.
We may not see it that way, but think about a viewer - how would they see it?

[Lazlo Toth]

At this point in my career, I generally have just one question:

did the check clear?

[Tripe Face]

Originally posted by Ferrycrossthemersey:
It's plagarism to me. I wouldn't do that to anyone; nor would I voice anything that I hadn't written.For the record folks, Ferry does NOT want to work in a major market or a network.

Too bad, I heard you had mad tv skillz!

[s'news]

I've gathered about one million bites that were used in other people's packages, without a credit to me, and I have no problem with that.

I've seen where they took the copy from a vosot and used it in a package, and I thought that was lame. My reason has nothing to do with plagiarism. I just think they should have written something new.

Print people also share notes. It happens all the time. In print, when it is substantial enough, the donor is also listed as a contributor at the end of the story.

[Ferrycrossthemersey]

facts and Michigan:

I am a reporter. I write my own stuff. No exceptions. And no, I don't want to be an anchor.

[Oh Snap]

As a producer, I take the vid that our photogs shoot, log it and write to that. I write for about six hours, then someone else reads what I wrote. Then I go home and hear my scripts verbatim when I watch later newscasts. When I go online, I see the scripts I wrote on our website, but my name is never on them. The name of whoever posted them is. At a previous station, I would sometimes hear my writing on the radio. And sometimes I'll write a package that an anchor or reporter will voice or front. Is all that right or fair? I don't know. But I accepted it when I took on a producing job (which I love). It seems like it would be difficult to find a job in journalism that isn't a collaborative effort. And that's probably a good thing. Checks & balances and all...

[Spike]

Originally posted by Ferrycrossthemersey:
I am a reporter. I write my own stuff. No exceptions. And when someone else at your station uses your writing, that's NOT plagiarism.

[Rosenblum]

The Economist, an excellent news magazine does not use bylines at all. It does not detract from the quality of their work or reporting.

The New York Times is called The New York Times, NOT The New York Times With Tom Friedman.

When you work for a journalistic organziation and write for that organization, the organization owns what you are writing and can use it in any way they wish, so long as that (hopefully) improves the delivery of the product.

If you take the work of someone else and willfully and knowlingly claim it as your own original work, then that is plagerism. And the victim, actually, is the organization for whom you work, not the general public.

[Ferrycrossthemersey]

At my network, no one else "uses" my writing.

[Rosenblum]

Here's a question for you.
When I was at CBS News, I often wrote the scripts. The talent read 'em.
Was that someone else 'using' my writing?
Should I have voiced my own pieces instead?
Was Kuralt a plagerist?

[Lazlo Toth]

In years past, I had field producers write scripts for me occasionally. I would go through and modify them a bit here and there, but read them pretty much as written. No big deal.

[Ferrycrossthemersey]

I know that happens, I just can't do it. Don't WANT to, either. I like my words better than others.

[Spike]

Originally posted by Rosenblum:
Was Kuralt a plagerist?It's simply amazing to me that someone who can't spell plagiarism could ever be hired as a writer, much less for someone like Kuralt.

Originally posted by Ferrycrossthemersey:
I know that happens, I just can't do it. Don't WANT to, either. I like my words better than others.That's lovely. But even if you WERE to do it, it still wouldn't be plagiarism.

[ March 11, 2007, 06:46 PM: Message edited by: Spike ]

[Rosenblum]

Originally posted by Spike:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Rosenblum:
Was Kuralt a plagerist?It's simply amazing to me that someone who can't spell plagiarism could ever be hired as a writer, much less for someone like Kuralt.

Originally posted by Ferrycrossthemersey:
I know that happens, I just can't do it. Don't WANT to, either. I like my words better than others.That's lovely. But even if you WERE to do it, it still wouldn't be plagiarism.</font>[/QUOTE]does not take much to amaze you does it? Come back later, I will do some simple magic tricks.

[Sir Dropham Pants]

Originally posted by Ferrycrossthemersey:
At my network, no one else "uses" my writing.What about VOs and VO/SOTs? If you write them and then an anchor reads them, isn't that "using" your writing without attribution?
I understand that we may just be talking about packages here, but the average viewer really doesn't know the difference.

[Spike]

Originally posted by Rosenblum:
Come back later, I will do some simple magic tricks.Like pulling unfounded savings claims of 60-70% out of your ass?

[Rosenblum]

Originally posted by Spike:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Rosenblum:
Come back later, I will do some simple magic tricks.Like pulling unfounded savings claims of 60-70% out of your ass?</font>[/QUOTE]Like trying to make you disappear. I have the chain, the straight jacket, the combination locks and the trunk. The Hudson River is nearby. Lemme know when you're ready.

[NDP]

Gentlemen, gentlemen! There's no fighting in here, this is the war room.

[The Mockingbird]

Originally posted by Rosenblum:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Spike:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Rosenblum:
Come back later, I will do some simple magic tricks.Like pulling unfounded savings claims of 60-70% out of your ass?</font>[/QUOTE]Like trying to make you disappear. I have the chain, the straight jacket, the combination locks and the trunk. The Hudson River is nearby. Lemme know when you're ready.</font>[/QUOTE]Realizing, of course, that death threats on the internet have resulted in people getting arrested and convicted.

SIOUX FALLS, S.D. — A former Veterans Administration law enforcement officer from New York state will serve six months of home confinement for threatening to kill a Rapid City woman through e-mail.
Edward S. Grenawalt, 47, of Yonkers, N.Y., pleaded guilty Monday in U.S. District Court in Rapid City to one count of making a threatening communication and was sentenced to two years probation.

Besides the home detention, U.S. District Judge Karen Schreier also restricted his use of the Internet.

The woman, Paula Reynolds, said Grenawalt threatened her for seven years over Internet chat rooms, e-mail and on her Web site dedicated to fallen police officers.

"The man had a real problem with wanting to cut me up, spread my body parts all over town and have my husband look for them," said Reynolds, whose spouse, Bill is a corporal with the Pennington County Sheriff's Department.

"I'm glad it's over and I'm glad I don't have to be afraid to leave my house anymore. If someone says they're going to shoot you off your doorstep, you're afraid."

Reynolds, 44, said she met Grenawalt on an America Online chatroom for law enforcement officers but they saw each other in person for the first time Monday in court.

"When I first met him he was trying to pump into everyone's head that the Internet is not for entertainment purposes. He always claimed he was the dark side of AOL. He was going to show AOL that chatroom forums were not to be," she said.

His online names included "dethr0W" and "certndeth," Reynolds said.

"AOL knew full well of him. But they could never do anything with him because they could never track him down because he was using other people's accounts," she said.

AOL's corporate communications office did not return a telephone call Monday seeking comment.

Reynolds said she never provoked Grenawalt and he won't say why he threatened her.

"He would only respond that he was keeping me around for entertainment purposes," she said.

Grenawalt made numerous threats over the years but "one e-mail of him saying he would torture me to death is what hung him," Reynolds said.

Assistant U.S. Attorney Robert Mandel said charges of Internet threats are rare but statutes are being applied to Internet use, just as they have been for telephone threats.

"Ultimately it is possible to run this down and find out who's doing it. It's an involved process but it can be done. Nobody should think it is completely anonymous if they're engaged in criminal activity," he said.

Reynolds hopes the conviction and sentence makes other Net users think twice.

"You cannot sit behind a computer and make death threats against someone and defame their character and not be responsible for your actions," she said.

Paula Reynolds' site is online at copadorer.com.


[ March 12, 2007, 04:18 AM: Message edited by: The Mockingbird ]

[Michigan J. Frog]

Originally posted by Ferrycrossthemersey:
At my network, no one else "uses" my writing.Must be a small network.

[The Mockingbird]

It's not the size of your network it's the trending of the demographics.

[Ferrycrossthemersey]

Hey, whatever you want to think is fine with me.

[facts]

It's a network, in that it's a podcast.. and his mom listens.. so HA.

[wxgeek]

Originally posted by The Mockingbird:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Rosenblum:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Spike:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Rosenblum:
Come back later, I will do some simple magic tricks.Like pulling unfounded savings claims of 60-70% out of your ass?</font>[/QUOTE]Like trying to make you disappear. I have the chain, the straight jacket, the combination locks and the trunk. The Hudson River is nearby. Lemme know when you're ready.</font>[/QUOTE]Realizing, of course, that death threats on the internet have resulted in people getting arrested and convicted.
</font>[/QUOTE]Or at least banned from Medialine. We can only hope.

[cinehead]

Originally posted by wxgeek:
Or at least banned from Medialine. We can only hope.We don't like what someone has to say, so let's ban them so we don't have to hear it!